road tax based on co2

Road tax is unfair

Original Post
Posted At
15/09/2008

Yaffle
Yaffle
it doesn't seem fair taxing big cars so much without taking into account how much or how little they're used. Wouldn't it be more fair to scrap road tax and pay tax on use only I.e through fuel tax on fuel?
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Yaffle

Posts: 21
Posted At: 15/09/2008 21:30:50

it doesn't seem fair taxing big cars so much without taking into account how much or how little they're used. Wouldn't it be more fair to scrap road tax and pay tax on use only I.e through fuel tax on fuel?
GPT

Posts: 8
Posted At: 23/10/2008 20:35:14

Isn't there only one total amount of CO2 that can be releaced from a litre of petrol? if so I agree that a fairer system would be to reduce the VED to next to nothing and to increase the tax on petrol by 1 or 2p then people could decide to be "green" if they wanted to. Not everyone can afford a new fuel efficent car.

Also which is "greener" a 4x4 driven 3000 miles a year at 15mpg or an eco car driven 12000 a year at 50mpg - as the 4x4 uses les fuel it would be the "greener" car, so why do they have to pay more VED than my car which does do 50mpg but is clogging up the roads longer?

Also if the VED was trnsferred to the cost of petrol, then any not UK cars which use our roads for free would also contribute.
Rob 62

Posts: 1
Posted At: 24/10/2008 22:03:34


I drive a large 4x4 vehicle but only for a reason. I actually need this type of vehicle for my job, needing to tow a 3.5 tonne trailer and take machines across fields to sites. It seems unfair that I have to pay the higher £400 + road tax. If you can prove that this type of vehicle is a commercial vehicle, then surely there should be a different tax band. We are paying for people using this type of vehicle for everday use. Do you think I have a point or am I totally wrong ?
Ironically, I use the vehicle to transport and demonstrate machinery used in conservation work. Machines for people helping the environment !
Drakey1947

Posts: 1
Posted At: 24/11/2008 15:27:59

I totally agree with this point of view. I own a Jaguar with a 3.2 litre engine, my road tax was £210 for the year, yet I do far less miles than my son who owns a Citroen C2 whose tax was £145 for the year. I'm positive he adds far more CO2 into the atmosphere than I do, but I pay the substantially higher road tax.

Scrap the road fund licence altogether, and put the extra cost on to fuel so that the user pays.

My current beef is all the work allegedly being done for cyclists. New lanes, new lane markings, more space etc. etc yet they pay no tax or insurance to be on the road. Many of them totally flout road markings, go through red lights, endanger pedestrians and car/motor cycle users who always get the blame should a poor cyclist get knocked over.

They sneak up on your near side even when you are signalling to turn left, they do not have to pass any sort of test to be on the roads and when its suits them, simply use the pavements and swear and curse at drivers who happen to be pulling out of their own driveways and are not expecting to be "hunted down" by a cyclist on the pavement.

Cyclists who use their bikes on main roads should be asked to pass a road worthiness test, both the cycle and the cyclist, they should pay a small road fund licence, (until it is scrapped of course) and they should be insured.
Chopper

Posts: 4
Posted At: 24/11/2008 23:35:13

As a user of HGV,Car,Motorhome and Avid Cyclist,i totally agree with all the above (even Drakey on cyclist)
Badders

Posts: 1
Posted At: 22/01/2009 22:09:13

Hello

I recently purchased an X reg A class Merc diesel (up to 65MPG, 139 g/km) to replace my S Reg 2.0 RT Renault Espace (Up to 35MPG 254g/Km . My intention was to save a bit on fuel and to be a bit greener, which I have achieved. I just noticed that with the new road tax changes if my A class had been registered a few months later the Road tax would be around £80 cheaper at £120!!! instead of what looks like £200+ in 2011, for the same vehicle!!!
As the Co2 emissions are known and registered for this model at 139g/Km, why can I not get the new tax banding for the vehicle?

Surely there are going to be 100's of 1000's of economical little X/Y reg vehicles out there that will be virtually unsellable and end up scrapped (causing alot of pollution) because of this strange situation, whilst people are encouraged to keep the many 1000's of large engined high pollution vehicles on the road. As I only drive 6000 miles a year (to and from work) in the vehicle I might as well Bu#!er the environment, have some luxury and P/X my little Merc for a nice 2000 Range rover I might even make something on the deal.


Badders
Carboncopy

Posts: 2
Posted At: 28/01/2009 10:43:30

Quoting GPT (23/10/2008 @ 20:35:14):
Isn't there only one total amount of CO2 that can be releaced from a litre of petrol?



I also cannot understand if you burn 1 kilogram of Hydrocarbon (Petrol) it should produce H2O from the hydrogen and CO + CO2 from the carbon. If some cars produce lower CO2 levels than the theoretical amount based on the molecular weight of Hydrogen and Carbon and the various constituent amounts of hydrocarbons making up petrol.
Where does the rest of the Carbon go?
If I only burn 2 gallon of petrol a week then I put into the atmosphere the carbon held in that petrol as CO2. I only do 3000 miles a year as i'm retired.
I reduced my mileage from 12,000 miles per year, I pay less as I burn and polute less, as the advert on the tele says simpalls.

The thinking behind putting up road tax on cars already purchased and calling it a green tax is illogicalls!
Will this not affect the car industry even leading to lay offs and short time working.



Carboncopy

Posts: 2
Posted At: 29/01/2009 09:45:56

Have just checked my vehicle fuel documents and it shows emissions are quoted as CO2 in grams per Kilometre. Therefore it is a tax that does not take into account the full facts because total CO2/year is a function of total distance travelled in that year. Would we pay gas and electric based on the size of house we own? The only fair way is per gallon, that way it is directly proportional to the amount used, use less polute less pay less, simpalls!
I have a car that will do 127mph, I would hardly expect to get a speeding ticket based on my cars potential top speed on the assumption that I had at some stage done that speed. Mind you it won't be long before all cars are fitted by law with trackers on the excuse it will be used to tax you for use of certain roads at certain times at a rate to be decided. In reality it will be an anti crime tool and that will include speeding. I wonder how long it will be before our every move is recorded on some big brother computer. Note to all would be bank robbers use a car without a tracker and do not put the address of the banks you intend to rob into the cars satnav.
1annoyeddriver

Posts: 1
Posted At: 08/02/2009 18:44:50

i am rather confused by emmision rates, according to my logbook, my emmisions are 0.518 g/km what does this mean compared with the table? what band would this put me in?
Jaguar

Posts: 1
Posted At: 05/03/2009 22:30:07

As the UK produces less than 1% of the world's carbon emissions why doesnt our government accept that anything we do on this tiny island has a miniscule effect on climate change or whatever? I have repteatedly asked politicians to explainn how charging me £400 VED is going to help the environment but I have yet to receive a valid explanation. Oh well never mind....at least our non-driving PM can tell his pal Obama he is leading the way while my VED helps bail out the banks!
rennetsjr

Posts: 1
Posted At: 14/03/2009 11:07:37

I've just checked the VED for my Astra 1.8. This year £210 couple of years time £245. I'm being punished for a purchase that i made 3 years ago and no doubt these figures will change to the GOV's advantage at a whim. In a high percentage of cases, the bigger the car the more you'll fuel you may use. I've done 18000 miles in 3 yrs in my astra, but in 3yrs i've done 93,000 miles in my works 7.5t lorry. Yet its tax is £160 and drinks fuel. Its produces more co2. The Greeen Tax should really go onto fuel duty a penny or two. Do away with road tax perhaps a road register fee. This will also do away with road tax avaders. Oh and 1 thing that really is bugging me!!!! more pot holes and the very poor state of the roads.
barkaye

Posts: 5
Posted At: 15/03/2009 15:16:08

road tax based on a formula including CO2, cc & fuel economy would seem a bit fairer to me - some small automatics are quite penalised under the current system as a 1400cc auto can produce (under lab conditions) the same CO2 in g/km as a far bigger car with over 2000cc.
I don't believe the quoted CO2 for each car is a reliable figure in real world driving either
BigMacca1965

Posts: 1
Posted At: 23/04/2009 14:07:24

This is a no brainer! I dont really understand why Mr Darling et al. cant get their heads around this one. I have always thought that the road tax should be abolished and that the tax should be on fuel - simple - the more you use the more you pay. as previous replies have said there is only a set amount of CO2 can be created from each litre of fuel. some cars do produce more CO2 if they did not we would not have different bands, but then some cars get more mileage out of their fuel, the cars that get better fuel consumption usually tend to have better CO2 figures. I really cant see the need for 13 bands and also a 13 "Showroom" bands for the first year. talk about making things complicated for complicated's sake. You could say the same about the TV licence and so many other things this government comes up with. Time for a change (rules and governments!)
magnacarta

Posts: 2
Posted At: 27/04/2009 16:02:44

Always was an unfair way of taxing the motorist but when we have a government with such hatred for the motor car what else can we expect ?.
Its time for the motorist to take matter in there own hands and lay up your car for one whole week (7 days) just think how much revenue would be lost it might just wake this lot up.
guru

Posts: 1
Posted At: 07/05/2009 22:00:45

Quoting BigMacca1965 (23/04/2009 @ 14:07:24):
This is a no brainer! I dont really understand why Mr Darling et al. cant get their heads around this one. I have always thought that the road tax should be abolished and that the tax should be on fuel - simple - the more you use the more you pay. as previous replies have said there is only a set amount of CO2 can be created from each litre of fuel. some cars do produce more CO2 if they did not we would not have different bands, but then some cars get more mileage out of their fuel, the cars that get better fuel consumption usually tend to have better CO2 figures. I really cant see the need for 13 bands and also a 13 "Showroom" bands for the first year. talk about making things complicated for complicated's sake. You could say the same about the TV licence and so many other things this government comes up with. Time for a change (rules and governments!)

i work at an mot station and alot of the newer so called high co2 hc etc output is alot lower than most normal sized cars, and u pay loadz more for tax, i think it is to do with the manuafactur of the vehicle it self
POTHOLER

Posts: 2
Posted At: 15/09/2009 22:52:43

Totally agree with most replies regarding large cars doing low miles and small cars doing high miles, Seems pretty unfair. I suppose the answer could be higher fuel prices and abolishing road tax but the gready government wouldnt be satisfied with only 1 or 2 p /litre to cover the loss of duty revenue. Double figures would be more like it I suspect.
silver surfer

Posts: 1
Posted At: 05/11/2009 09:28:11

I have covered under 4000 miles per year since I bought my Renalult Clio 2 ltr Sports. My road tax is currently £210, but will increase next year. It is a Y Reg. and the mileage is now just turned 29,000. I would certainly be happy to pay tax on fuel.

This has been tried in the Channel IIslands (Guernsey and Jersey) for some while now. Naturally this cut down the work load at DVLA, plus cost of Tax Discs and other printing requirements. It also captured drivers who evaded paying the Road Fund Licence. The vehicles still have to fdisplay a disc, this is stating they are insured which would be a great advantage here in UK. as I understand there are thousands of vehicles which are un-insured..
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